Episode 61: Climate Activism
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Looking Outside is for curious people looking for a fresh take on familiar topics, in business and beyond.
We’ve covered climate change and environmental causes before on Looking Outside, focused on the innovation that’s helping to create new solves for existing problems. On this episode, we’re exploring this topic from a human perspective, looking at what sociology and the study of historical patterns of collective human behavior can tell us about how we’re reacting to, and in some cases rebelling against, the climate change challenge today. To do this, we’re joined by social scientist Dr Dana R. Fisher, Director of the Center for Environment, Community, & Equity (CECE) and a Professor in the School of International Service at American University. Dana has studied and written about the combined relationship of social and environmental change for over two decades.
As a sociologist, Dana first became interested in the topic of climate change by studying climate activists. The rise of climate protests became an example of what she calls “social sausage making”; the study of how social groups and collective norms are shaped and shift. As this was just at the commencement of the climate movement, and at a tipping point of escalation for these exasperated groups, Dana incidentally found endless case studies.
25 years and nine books on the topic later, Dana describes why we are seeing the rise of climate protestors (who are throwing soup on paintings and getting arrested for small acts of vandalism) and what role they play in driving awareness to the cause. On the show, and in a more detailed way in her book Saving Ourselves, Dana describes how with their somewhat shocking acts the protestors are trying to “shock” the world. Whatever grabs the most media attention, the better. Quite like a real electric shock, the intent is to jolt us out of our comfortable, predictable daily patterns.
Despite the fact that these acts annoy and frustrate, they also are designed to garner sympathy. Obviously not from everyone, but from "moderates"; those people who are not extremely opposed to environmental action one way or another. By creating an outrageous new reference point for reaction, they make the smaller acts of compromise we can all take seem a little more reasonable.
Through her study of various activist movements including Civil Rights and Women’s Suffrage, Dana saw this strategy, known as the “Radical Flank Effect”, play out successfully by driving a regression to the mean. It also, she says, rarely turns violent. In fact, while Dana labels this 'non-violent civil disobedience', and inarguably a right of citizens in democratic nations, she sees concerning trends of oppression in response, from the state.
Since we have a case study of over 30 years worth of political commitments towards climate action, alongside a warming earth, Dana says one of the best ways we're going to see any substantive change is through a more personal response to climate related issues. Even if it starts with a cringe response to climate protestors. Dana stresses that history tells us we cannot rely on governmental action alone to do this because governmental policy is fiscally tied and pre-incentivized.
While Dana recognizes that fossil fuel energy literally fuels our life and can't be simply switched off, she does stress the negatives of incremental future investments in it -investments that may commit us to 30 or 40 additional years (up to 60 according to some sources) of fossil fuel dependency, due purely on a ROI commitment we sign today.
And so, Jo and Dana discuss the role that the individual plays towards driving environmental action, by voting with their wallet, their literal ballet vote, or protesting on their platform (hopefully, in not violent ways), particularly if they are in a privileged position to be able to do so.
To look outside, Dana dedicates time to her kids, playing a lot of games together, while walking away from her work. Dana knows from her research that being a present parent directly impact their ability to be great adults and lead our future.
Dana R. Fisher is a dynamic speaker and author who writes about activism, democracy and climate policy. Her most recent book, Saving Ourselves: from Climate Shocks to Climate Action, was published in 2024 by Columbia University Press. She is the Director of the Center for Environment, Community, & Equity (CECE) and a Professor in the School of International Service at American University. Her current projects include evaluating the ways that nationally coordinated service corps programs are expanding their climate-related work and the effects of all sorts of activism, engagement, and protest.
Fisher is a Nonresident Senior Fellow with the Governance Studies program at The Brookings Institution and the chair of the Political Sociology section of the American Sociological Association. She served as a Contributing Author for Working Group 3 of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change's Sixth Assessment Review (IPCC AR6) writing about citizen engagement and civic activism. Her media appearances include ABC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, PBS Newshour, and various programs on NPR, BBC, and CBC. Her words have appeared in the popular media, including in the Washington Post, Slate, TIME Magazine, Politico, the Nation, and the American Prospect.
Dana earned her undergraduate degree from Princeton University and a Ph.D. in Sociology from the University of Wisconsin, Madison. She has authored over eighty research papers and book chapters and has written seven books.
More on at www.danarfisher.com
Learn more about the Center for Environment, Community, & Equity
Dana's books can be found on Amazon
Looking Outside listeners can get 20% Dana's latest book Saving Ourselves with code "CUP20" via the publisher
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